Ep 148 – “Fear Is A Prison, Fight For Your Dreams”

Giacomo:

Hello, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of vegan proteins mussels by Brussels Radio. My name is Giacomo.

Speaker 2

And I’m Danny.

Giacomo:

And this is episode 148. All right, everybody, I’m very honored to have one of our teammates on the vegan strong plantbuilt team here today. And I want to welcome Ashley Kitchens to our listeners. You are a crossfit athlete, and we had the honor of having you compete with us. You’re also a dietitian and the owner.

Ashley:

Of plant centered nutrition.

Giacomo:

Tell us more about yourself. What, what, uh, what inspired you to start your business?

Ashley:

Ooh. Okay, so this is. I’m gonna have to go back to my childhood, if you don’t mind. It’s like, it’s a long story that I won’t. I’ll keep short as possible. So, plant center nutrition came from, honestly, 25 plus years of health issues that I struggled with. So, Giacomo, I think. I think you know this. I grew up on an Angus cattle farm, and when I tell you I never expected to be plant based vegan, I never expected it.

And I think probably a lot of your listeners can maybe relate to that. It’s like, we just didn’t think that this was going to happen in our lifetime. So I grew up with a lot of health issues, as you can imagine. I was eating tons of meat and eating a lot of dairy growing up on this farm, and I was having a lot of health issues, specifically gut issues, if you can think of kind of chronic constipation in the worst possible way.

That’s what I was struggling with growing up. And I would go to the doctors, they couldn’t figure out

what was wrong. They would just give my parents medication, send me home, and that was it. Well, I ended up stumbling across, this is later in life, still having these health issues. I was like, you know, I’m going to become a registered dietitian.

I love food. I love talking about food. So why not make it into a career? And so I did that. But I was still, again, I was not plant based, I was not vegan. I was still having all of these health issues, which I was honestly keeping to myself, because we don’t really like to talk about our bowel movements or our gut health. It’s just not a topic of conversation that usually comes up.

And I was educating the patients, the clients that I was seeing at the time, if they had chronic constipation, I was kind of giving them the blanket response of, okay, well, you just need to drink more water, move your body, eat more fiber, and you should be fine, right? Well, I was doing those exact same things, and nothing was changing. I was still having these health issues, and I ended up coming across a documentary around 2011 2012 called forks over knives.

And I was blown away by the information that I was watching. I truthfully, Giacomo even getting my masters in public health and nutrition, I really hadn’t heard much about plant based eating. It really didn’t actually exist much at the time. You know, the term was just starting to be used. Doctor Campbell, you know, was just coming out with his book, the China Study.

And so it was gaining some popularity, some traction, but it really wasn’t taught in school, at least back when I was in school. And so I watched this documentary, and I’m like, what the heck? Why did I not know this? And so I started just adding more plants to my diet because I was kind of afraid to go full on plant based, because, again, this was very, very different from my childhood, where meat was the center of every single meal.

And so I started adding more plants to my diet, and I started feeling so much better. I started going to the bathroom more regularly. I wasn’t as crampy and bloated. I was like, okay, maybe there is something to this, because, I’ll be honest, I was a little resistant because I didn’t really want to go plant based at the time. But honestly, I was desperate to try anything because I had tried a lot of different diets, I had tried a lot of different medications and suppositories, so I was

ready for something new. And again, the more plants I ate, the better I felt. And I was like, well, forget this. I’m not going back to my old way of eating because I feel too good to want to feel that way again. And so I figured if I. If I am one person out there who can benefit from eating plant based and kind of really just change their health entirely, there’s got to be somebody else on this planet that can also benefit from it.

And, of course, forks overnight kind of hypes that up, too. And so that’s when I was like, I’m already a registered dietitian. I don’t really know why I became registered dietitian, other than loving food. So maybe being plant based, becoming plant based was also why I was meant to be a dietitian. I just felt like the stars were sort of aligning, and I was destined, in a way, I know that sounds kind of like, maybe hokey a little bit, but I was destined, in a way, to use my expertise as a

registered dietitian to also help other people transition to a plant based diet or even help them come off medications or put their type two diabetes into remission by helping them go plant based. And so that’s where plant centered nutrition came to be. And I know it’s a long story, but that’s how it all started.

Giacomo:

No, and I’m honestly, genuinely interested in the nooks and crannies, the finer details of girl who grew up on an Angus cattle farm to adult who became dietician, and then everything else after the fact, like that. To me, that just, that’s the dub, like, all the stuff before that, and the, the digestion issues around that. Like, what was your, what were your eating habits like as a, as, um, as a teenager and as a child? I’m curious.

Ashley:

So I was very active as a child. Um, obviously, I I woke up. So we moved to this farm when I was in, I think it was third grade. And so even then, at nine years old, I was waking up at 05:00 a.m. helping my dad with the cows, helping feed them, you know, making sure everyone was taken care of. And I did that up until my sophomore year of high school. And a large part of my childhood was eating a lot of food, because not only was I active on the farm, but I also played soccer.

I end up running track, and as you can imagine, in the midwest, good old midwestern Indiana diet. I ate a lot of casseroles, a lot of meat, potatoes. I remember giacomo, one time, my family took us to, like, a special dinner. They took us to a steakhouse, and I remember ordering a filet and being like, dad, this doesn’t taste like the meat that we eat, you know, because ours was much more fresh.

It was, you know, right from the farm. And so there was a huge quality difference in what we were getting out versus what we were eating at home. But to say all that meat was a huge part of my diet. Breakfast, lunch, and dinner, you know, bacon, sausage, eggs for breakfast. Definitely something meat centered. Honestly, a lot of lunchables for lunch. Um, and a lot, a lot of meat for dinners.

Giacomo:

Okay, see, that I wouldn’t have assumed. I know. I farm access to, like you said, what was at the time, fresh, fresh food. However, the meat for centered around your three squares, and then sometimes, like, in between or whatever, just a very heavy meat centric diet.

Ashley:

Yes, very. And, of course, dracomo, you can’t forget a glass of milk with every meal as well. So that was very important. That’s a good old nineties childhood, though, I think for a lot of us.

Giacomo:

Very, very much so. Gotcha. And then when you became a dietitian, before you got on the whole plant based tip, what were you finding as far as where the information was taking you, your studies, with how you were eating?

Ashley:

Yeah. So I originally actually wanted to be a sports dietitian. I ended up shadowing Roberta anding, who was down with the Houston Texans and the Houston Astros down in obviously the Houston area. And so that’s what I wanted to do. And of course, I will say back then, which is like over a decade ago now, the idea was, get as much calories into these athletes as possible.

And so that’s kind of what I was doing too, because I was still really active. So it’s like, you know, how much meat can I eat? Make sure I’m eating meat. Gosh, I got to have protein if I’m still, you know, active, playing some soccer, you know, running around. And my studies really pointed to not necessarily using food as a form of medicine. It was more as a form of, okay, if you’re already sick, then here’s how we can maybe adjust your diet a little bit to help with the ailments that

you’re undergoing. And it wasn’t necessarily, you know, let’s drastically change to a more fiber rich, antioxidant rich, or anti inflammatory diet. It was more of just like, okay, well, maybe we can, you know, maybe let’s do chicken instead of steak, or let’s do, um, like regular whole milk versus skim milk if you need more fat or something like that. So there wasn’t really a whole lot of emphasis on vegan or plant based eating at the time either.

Giacomo:

Okay, interesting. Gotcha. So the information you were finding during your studies as a dietitian, that information wasn’t necessarily steering you in a completely different direction or even 50% in a different direction.

Ashley:

Yeah, 0%. Yeah. The only thing, giacomo, I remember from my studies, and this could also be related to my memory, was that vegans needed vitamin b. Twelve. That was really the main thing that we were taught in our, you know, well over 1000 hours of nutrition education that we were receiving between our clinical experiences and everything that we were studying in school as well.

Giacomo:

Interesting. That’s pretty fascinating, actually. And tell me more about your athletic background and your interest in sports medicine, your interest for yourself as far as across the athlete. How did that all come to be?

Ashley:

So I have always been really active. Like I said, I played soccer up through college, I ran track through high school, and I just, I loved being active after soccer, you know, after kind of graduating from

college and going into grad school, I still played here and there a little bit, but not a whole lot. So I found myself running a lot. And I will say I enjoyed running, but there was something that was missing.

First of all, the, when you’re on a team sport, it’s really hard to get that when you’re running by yourself, like that camaraderie, that enthusiasm of being with other people. And so I found that was a big piece of my life that was really lacking, that just community aspect of everyone getting together and working out together, kind of, after all, in a way, one goal.

And so I found myself, I actually remember this and found myself sitting on a couch, kind of just being a little sad that I didn’t have that community, that I really didn’t have any muscle whatsoever, Giacomo, because I was just running. And I remember thinking, there’s got to be a gym near me that has this sort of missing piece that I’m looking for.

And so I ended up looking up boot camps near me and I was like, I’m just going to do this for a couple months. Just feel it out, see how it goes. Well, that was well over ten years ago and I’m still doing it. So I signed up for this boot camp, this three month boot camp at a Crossfit gym. And Giacomo, I walk in and I’m seeing these girls over in the corner doing handstand push ups, and I’m like, wow, like, I want to do that someday, someday.

And that, honestly is what hooked me. I was like, this is not just going to be a three month commitment. This is going to be something that I’m going to be doing for a long time. And so I end up going through that three month stand and then after a couple years of doing just boot camp, which is basically crossfit without the barbell, you know, we use a lot of kettlebells, we do a lot of body related movements.

And then I went up and started doing Crossfit and the rest is history. I just, I loved it so much because not only was I part of this community that was just so captivating and invigorating, you know, just really, I looked forward to going every single day, and I still do. But also I loved getting stronger. I loved seeing my body change. I loved even adapting the way I was eating a little bit so I could fuel and recover really well.

And at the time when I started this, I was already plant based. And so that was even more cool was to see my body change and to see that, oh, I’m not any slower or any less weak than my colleagues or my other crossfit athletes that are eating meat and dairy or drinking their whey protein shakes. So that was, that was a really cool piece, too.

Giacomo:

I remember the culture around the paleo and the keto. We’re going like, circa 15 years ago, something like that. And there was such a stigma around, you couldn’t use the v word at a box, at a cross jim, forget it. There was so much. I don’t wanna say there was hate, but it was. If I had to say there was judgment. It was a little bit condescending and almost sort of like, look, you need to do something differently.

And I don’t know. Cause I wasn’t in that culture, but from the outside looking in and just from little snippets of working with athletes, they were not on discouraged. They were trying to sway athletes

into eating differently.

Ashley:

Oh, yeah. Yes, there was definitely that. In fact, I started posting my journey on social media, and I would have other plant based athletes who were lifting weights or doing something like, yeah, my coach is pressuring me to eat meat. Or they say that’s the only way I’m going to get strong. And be like, no. Like, I am now set out to show that you do not need me to be strong.

Because at the time, really, I didn’t know either. I was like, you know, am I. Am I doing this right? I was very new to sort of everything at the time. But again, the more you learn, the more you practice, the more you kind of make some adjustments with what you’re eating, how you’re training. It’s. It is incredible. But I will say I definitely have had many, many questions over my, you know, ten plus years of crossfitting where people are like, where do you get your protein?

Or are you sure you’re eating enough protein? I remember this one guy. We were both deadlifting. We were kind of sharing a barbell. We were both deadlifting together. We were using the same weight. And he was like, are you sure you get enough protein? And I’m like, we’re deadlifting the same amount. Like, I think I’m getting more than enough.

Giacomo:

So, yeah, gosh. And then you started working with clients one on one. Not just athletes, I would imagine, but athletes too, obviously.

Ashley:

Yeah. Yep. I have worked with some athletes, but yeah, most of my clientele is more. They’re looking to go plant based for health reasons or they have a history of disordered eating or just being on a lot of diets, and they’re sick of that. And they want to look at plant based eating as a way to truly nourish themselves, not just physically, but mentally and emotionally as well.

Giacomo:

And so you lean in on that focus wise, regardless of whether the person’s an athlete or your focus more on their lifestyle or whatever, wherever they’re coming to you from. Are people aware when they reach out to you of their eating habits and what their struggles are like? What percentage of clients would you say are keenly aware that, yes, I have disordered eating patterns? Yes, I probably struggle with some form of an eating disorder.

Ashley:

That is a really good question. I would say a lot of the clients I work with are pretty intuitive and they have an idea, but I think I say that. But then there’s also quite a few who don’t realize how much diet culture has really burdened them and kind of put these thoughts or, like, kind of adjusted their mindset to where it’s not helping their journey whatsoever, it’s not helping their relationship with food, where they feel like, well, you know, I probably should be counting

calories or maybe I should be stepping on the skate every single day. I mean, for most of the people that I work with, that isn’t necessary whatsoever. In fact, that’s only. It’s more likely to detract from their journey and their relationship with food. So sometimes I. It’s not quite this way, but sometimes it’s a bait and switch where they come in, they start working with me, and they think we’re going to work on one thing, and then we end up really trying to work on their

relationship with food because we sort of just kind of peel back these layers and realize, wow, there’s, there’s more work to do than maybe we realized in the beginning. And that’s always cool to see, too.

Giacomo:

Gotcha. So what, what do you find your, like, typical issues around? Well, you. Oh, you also help people make a switch to go to plant based.

Ashley:

Oh, yes, we make the switch. Yep. That is so fun, too. Yes.

Giacomo:

Which is something that Danny and I and Alison Athe, we’re not privy to as much. We have some clients who come to us and come to us because they’re ready to make the switch and they trust in, but we don’t have market our coaching like that, so we don’t. It’s not like yours where you’re. We don’t have that same kind of experience working one on one with clients as you do.

So can you tell me a little more about what that looks like when someone comes to you and they’re ready to make a change, like what the roadblocks are and what their perspective and perceptions are before they make the change and what their struggles are.

Ashley:

Yeah, yeah, definitely. So I’m going to speak. Actually, I’ll speak generically and also speak about one client that I recently worked with that was just, he had an incredible testimonial. But when people usually come to work with me, honestly, Giacomo, it’s usually not the food that’s the issue of going plant based. It’s usually everybody else sort of around them is often a big struggle.

You know, a lot of people, they’ve had this desire for quite a while. They’ve heard about the benefits of

plant based eating. Maybe they have high cholesterol, maybe their doctors, you know, saying, like, you know, hey, we might need to start you on some high blood pressure medication soon. They’ve done their research and they’re like, man, there’s something to this.

But maybe in their family, people are really resistant to going plant based. Or they kind of bring it up and it’s kind of pooh pooh, or it’s like, you know, food, it doesn’t really matter. Maybe even their doctor says that. I’ve definitely had some clients where their doctor says, it doesn’t matter what you eat, just keep eating what you’re eating.

You know, we’ll start you on medication. That’s really frustrating, but that’s happening less and less, which is nice. Um, once they start changing their diet, once they have a plan, some structure in place that really helps get the ball rolling. So we really kind of sit back and hone in on their why? Why do you want to go plant based? So we really try to establish that first and foremost, because that’s not only going to help them go plant based, but it also is going to help them stay

plant based. Because we know this journey is not this, like, perfect, you know, like, beautiful path that we’re walking down. There are some bumps along the way, and so when they have a really strong why, when there is a bump, it’s a little bit easier to get over that than if they don’t have a strong why. So we establish that first, then we sort of start to, I’m all about adding, not subtracting.

So we really focus on, what can we add to your plate to make it more plant forward until we eventually go 100% plant based. Um, and that is a really good feeling, too, I think, for them because they don’t feel like they’re restricting themselves. It’s like, okay, if you kind of like the, quote, standard american diet, meat, potatoes, vegetables, what can we kind of add a little bit to crowd out naturally without purposely doing it?

Crowd out some of that meat, um, so that you’re not missing it, and that’s really exciting. And then incorporate a lot of meal planning. That way they have, like, that plan and structure in place, because we know that, that having that foundation could be really beneficial for someone who’s transitioning to a plant based diet is having a little bit of a plan, um, which is really cool.

But let me tell you about this client that I worked with recently. So he came to me, um, an amazing person. He had just gotten out of his doctor’s office, basically, and his a one c was elevated, so he had full blown type two diabetes. His doctor was like, okay, we got to start you on metformin. We got start you on insulin, um, and get this under control as soon as possible.

And he’s in his sixties. I remember early sixties, and he was like, ashley, he’s like, I told my doctor that I want to just try some lifestyle changes, and then I’m going to go back in. I think it was six months. I’m going to get my a one c tested again, and then from there, my doctor and I will make a decision on what’s going to be best for me moving forward.

And I was like, all right. And he was motivated because sometimes that’s what it takes, is like, that had that pain point to really get you going. Um, and so we went 100% whole food plant based giacomo, his a one c. He goes back to the doctor six months later. His a one c is normal. His doctor is blown away. He, of course, loses a little bit of weight without trying.

He ends up actually, which I really appreciated about this, um, with him, he ends up hiring a personal trainer. So he was starting to be, you know, more active, which was really great, especially for his

blood sugars. And that, that in turn, he puts on a little bit more muscle mass. He also started working with a therapist. So between those three things, really working on his diet, starting to exercise a little bit more, and working on his mental and emotional health, that had a

huge impact on his health in general. And it was, oh, my goodness. I mean, when he graduated, it was so exciting because he was beaming. His doctor, of course, was beaming. His family was so excited. His kids were elated because, you know, he has grandkids as well, and they want their dad around as long as possible.

They don’t want him feeling yucky on medication. They don’t want blood sugar bottoming out or being too high. And I’m not feeling well, not being able to get down on the floor and play with his grandkids. So that was just a really exciting client to work with. That was recent, so.

Giacomo:

Yeah, that sounds highly rewarding. Their entire life changed, and it was a whole bunch of. It was a chain reaction, essentially. It started with what was on their plate and this idea that they could do something other than western in medicine as far as treating what they had already wound up being diagnosed with, with the diabetes. And then it sounds to me like it’s pretty was. It’s been pretty much a 180 with this individual.

Ashley:

Yes, yes. And we still keep in touch and it’s. Oh, it’s just, yeah, he’s just, he’s. I mean, not to put this lightly, but he truly is living his best life because he, truthfully, all of us, in a way, when it comes to our health. I remember someone saying this to me at a young age. It was someone who was older. I. They were like, you really do have two paths in life when it comes to your health. You’re going to either prioritize what is on your plate, you’re going to prioritize movement,

you’re going to prioritize your mental health, or you’re just kind of going to go through the motions. And whatever happens, happens when it comes to your health. And I truly believe he chose this path, and it’s not always the easy path. And it was really cool to see him just be so rewarded in a way, with his efforts. I’m really excited for him.

Giacomo:

Yeah, me too. I want to meet this man and give him a high five because it sounds like he got his life back.

Ashley:

Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Yeah.

Giacomo:

Wonderful. What do you feel like and what do you think are some of the repeating struggles that you see amongst your clients, as far as we’ll say, like, just disorder behavior? Because I think that that’s pretty typical among the majority of people. You’re just like you mentioned on your site, you’re not taught how to do these things as a child.

Right. Parents are tired, and they just want to find a way to help you fall asleep, wake up and go to school and whatever. But food is hard and food is personal, so there’s a lot of pain there. There’s a lot of confusion on how to feed yourself and all that. And then you wind up, unfortunately, inheriting a lot of the unhealthy behaviors around food that your family unintentionally instilled in you.

With all that, with someone’s past, they come to you now, they’re an adult, and they have to hopefully not too embarrassingly admit to themselves and to you, like, hey, I don’t know how to feed myself. Can you help? What finder are typical issues that you encounter?

Ashley:

Yeah, definitely. I can certainly talk about that. And before I do, I want to, I don’t know if anyone’s, if anyone is watching this intuitive eating. It’s a book and a workbook. It’s called the intuitive eating of book or workbook. It’s a really great guide, especially if you’re struggling with your relationship with food. I always recommend, I actually have all my clients work through, most of my clients work through this workbook or read the book because it really does give

you a completely different perspective on your relationship with food. And especially if you were raised in the eighties and nineties, the two thousands when diet was diet culture. I mean, it still is, but diet culture was so heavy. You know, the ads that we saw in the nineties just, it really affected our relationship with food. It affected a lot of people.

And so a big part of what I see, there’s a lot of things, but a big part of what I see is that food police. So that, that voice that’s inside of your head telling you, this is a bad food, this is a good food. If I eat this, quote, bad food, let’s use my, one of my favorite foods, a donut, for example, a good old vegan donut. If I eat this food, which is deemed, quote, bad by diet culture, and I’m a bad person, I failed.

I shouldn’t be eating that. Or if I eat this, if I choose the salad over french fries, then, oh, man, I’m a good person. I made the right choice. But that isn’t the case. I mean, if we think about food, food isn’t inherently good or bad. There’s no moral value when it comes to food. And so one of the things that I work on with a lot of my clients is trying to strip that voice and silence that voice as much as possible, strip the idea that food is good or bad and just look at food as food.

Because, Giacomo, a lot of, well, not a lot of us, we are born with that innate ability to regulate ourselves. You know, if you think about a baby, they cry when they’re hungry. They’re typically content when they’re full, and that’s it. But as we grow up, you know, we’re taught, oh, well, you, you have to eat your vegetables before you have ice cream for dessert or there’s starving children.

You have to finish your plate. And so these cues that were so strong when we were born, we start

questioning them or we start ignoring them, or the common thing that I hear is, oh, I just ate breakfast at 930, you know, it’s eleven. I shouldn’t be hungry yet, so I can’t eat. I’ve got to wait. I’ve got to wait two more hours. I’ve got to ignore that hunger, suppress that hunger, drink some water, chew some gum.

You know, these things that we’re taught to do to ignore our cues, which are really strong. And so one thing that we talk about a lot is when your body is telling you it’s hungry or it’s full, think of that as simply as going to the bathroom. You know, if you had to go to the bathroom, you wouldn’t be like, I just went 2 hours ago, I should not have to go to the bathroom right now.

I’m going to hold it for two more hours until I really should be going. And that’s the same with hunger. It really is just your body trying to communicate with you that it needs, needs some food. And so those are probably two of the main things that I see. One is labeling food as good or bad, and the other is trying to suppress or ignore maybe some of those cues that your body is telling you now, jocmo, when it comes to, when it comes to food being good or bad, I don’t, that’s not an excuse to,

oh, I’m just going to eat donuts all day long. Just think about it. If any of us just ate donuts all day long, we probably wouldn’t feel too well. And so that’s the idea. There is. If I have the, if I have the choice between an apple and a doughnut, for example, for a snack, more than likely and more often than not, I’m going to choose the apple because I’m not just choosing this food for taste alone, I’m choosing this food based on taste and how it’s going to make me feel.

So more often than not, I’m going to choose the apple because I’m going to probably feel pretty good when I eat it and it’s going to taste good. I, at least, I like apples. You can kind of insert whatever fruit you enjoyed. Now, the donuts, I’m going to probably choose every once in a while because there are going to be times where I’m like, you know, what?

I just really want a donut. You know, I just want something that kind of, that’s really sweet, tastes really good. I’m not too concerned with how I’m going to feel afterwards. So I’m going to eat the donut. And sometimes I’m going to choose both because I’m especially hungry. And so it’s almost looking at it like that. So it’s not necessarily an excuse to just eat whatever you want, because our body is also going to tell us, hey, you’ve, you’ve had, had a lot of donuts today.

Maybe it’s time to have something different. It’s almost like going on vacation. You know, when you’re only eating sort of like ultra processed foods all day long, when you come home, you’re like, I cannot wait to have a salad or a green smoothie or something like that. Cause it just sounds good.

Giacomo:

Gotcha. Paying attention to what food does for you, energy wise. Understanding that your hunger will tell you when you’re hungry and not as opposed to just pure craving, which you can honor, but also as you’re honoring those cravings, you start to realize, well, my energy is kind of crummy and my stomach doesn’t feel so good. So logically, maybe this is a bad idea. Psm. Also not hungry. Something like that.

Ashley:

Yeah. Yeah, there is, there’s a lot of mindfulness to it. You know, we live in such a busy, fast paced world, it can be really hard to like it to be in tune with your body when you’re just kind of checking, eating almost off, like, as like a checking it off like a box. Um, you’re just like, oh, I’m just gonna eat and move on to the next thing. So the more often you can kinda of practice mindfulness.

And when I say mindfulness, kind of a simple example of that is trying to go through your five senses when you’re eating. So, and I know we don’t all have the time to do that, but the more often you can sit down with your meal and kind of go through, oh, you know, oh, this, this food looks really good, it’s really colorful, or, oh, it smells really good.

Maybe you have like a nice stew, or think about what it tastes like, think about how it sounds when you’re chewing it, think about how it feels on your tongue, you know, is it hot, cold, that type of thing. That can just help you bring more awareness to what you’re eating. And that in turn is going to help you create a healthier relationship with food because you have that mindfulness and awareness with your eating.

It’s going to help you realize when you’re full, it’s going to help you realize how you know, how much more you need or do you even need to finish your meal at all? So there’s a lot of benefits to just trying to slow down a little bit, especially when it comes to your meals, when you can, so that you can create a more healthful relationship with the food that you’re eating.

Giacomo:

Totally. And we’re all different. So each person’s struggles around, their triggers that cause them to eat and their cravings and understanding all of that can be very confusing. So that’s where working with someone like you or us could possibly, or any coach in general and working on themselves, getting it out there can be really helpful, as opposed to saying, well, I am just going to eat a certain way.

I’m just going to make this routine. You have to do that. But if you don’t do the heavy lifting, you’re going to wind up repeating and making the same mistakes over and over again or feel like crap while you’re just following the typical four meals a day that are going to get you the results on paper that you’re looking for. And what have you learned about yourself? That being said, now that you have the base, Ashley, where someone is understanding their feelings around food, their

behaviors, their hunger cues, they’re learning how to be mindful and intuitive. They’ve done the work, they have the toolkit, they’re using it now. How do you put it into action in this fast paced world where they also have a healthy, we’ll say, menu or meal plan? Like, what does a routine look like for you for a client?

Ashley:

Yep, that’s a really great question because it’s not as simple as, oh, I fixed my relationship with food, I’m going to kind of go on and be completely fine. There’s still work. I mean, there’s still ongoing work that needs to be done. I still do the work. I know Jacmo, we’ve talked before. I know you still do the work. And one thing, when it comes to as you’re working on your relationship with food, that strategy

piece is also really important.

Doing a little bit of meal planning, maybe even doing a little bit of prepping for your week, trying to set yourself up for success as much as possible. So I like to use the intuitive piece, and I also like to use sort of more the strategic piece because those two combined can be really beneficial in having a really healthful relationship, relationship with food.

So one thing that I encourage when my clients, especially when they graduate, is to continue doing the work that we’re doing, whether it’s. There are so many great books on intuitive eating. So the more that you can read and just surround yourself with that information, the better off you’re going to be. Because again, when you’re in the, quote, real world, there are constantly ads being thrown out our way.

There are constantly, there’s diet talk all around us, especially, you know, around the holidays, around the new year. There can be just a lot of conversations around, oh, well, you know, you got to lose weight or don’t eat that much on thanksgiving. I mean, your, your body’s going to tell you what it wants, what it needs. But so one thing that I do encourage is obviously, yeah, continuing doing some meal planning, because, again, that’s going to help structure your week.

It’s going to help set you up for success and then also continue to educate yourself and practice the things that we were doing. When it comes to your intuition. Um, you also mentioned cravings, which I touched on it just a little bit, which I’m glad that you did, because that’s honestly another thing that we work on a lot. What a lot of people may not be aware of, a lot of the clients I work with is that cravings are pretty fleeting.

They’re not something that. That usually persists, you know, all day long or all week long. And if they are, then we have a strategy for that. But when a client is struggling with cravings, one thing that I have them do, and this is very hyper dependent on the person. So this is kind of a generic statement, but one thing I have them do is give themselves about five minutes to kind of understand.

Okay, well, where is this craving come from? You know, we are not robots like you kind of alluded to. We don’t have to eat. For most people, we don’t eat the same single thing every day. We don’t even really need the same thing every day. We might be a little bit hungrier one day, less hungry the next day. It’s so dependent on many, many factors, like sleep, stress, exercise, all those things.

And so when it comes to cravings, oftentimes I’ll have them pause for a few minutes and try and just, again turn inward, figure out where this craving is coming from. Am I bored? Am I stressed? I just get off, like, a stressful conversation with my mom on the phone and try and figure out where they’re coming from and then from there, making a decision based on what you feel like is best for you.

So not just once you have the craving, you just go and eat the food, but kind of take some time to understand where that’s coming from and realize, am I really hungry? Do I really want this? Or maybe my body’s telling me that I need to take a five minute break, go for a walk, knit, read a book, do something different than maybe what I’m doing. I wanted to make sure I put that in there.

Giacomo:

No, that’s wonderful. And I feel like sometimes when clients can’t do that, instead of thinking about failing, they’re still learning something about themselves. And then you remove the guilt after the fact because no one’s perfect. And sometimes you’re going to wind up overindulging in this and that.

And that’s not an excuse. It’s just a matter of, okay, well, you can usually learn something about yourself from something that you didn’t necessarily intend on doing but you chose to do, and then be emotionally helpful, healthy after the fact.

Ashley:

Yes. Yeah, and that’s such a great point. The idea is to not be perfect. The idea is to when you have a craving to never not go grab, you know, your chocolate covered peanuts ever again. The idea is just to try and create more awareness, because the more that you do that, the better off you’re going to be or the more confident you’re going to be in your food choices, and it’s going to just make you feel better, too.

Giacomo:

Are there any particular types of people that you work with where you feel like there’s some opportunity for you to still understand how to head a. Be more supportive? Like, in other words, like things that you feel like, okay, there’s got to be a solution here, but I haven’t figured out yet challenges challenging clients that you’re not. You can’t put a finger up, but you know that there’s something else that. That we can learn from them?

Ashley:

Yeah, absolutely. I’ve definitely had clients in the past where I’m like, okay, I need to probably do some more research in order to fully help them, or there have been times where I’ve referred them to other people because I know that they can benefit from someone who has more of an expertise in, like, this one particular area. So. Absolutely.

Giacomo:

Gotcha. Yeah, we go through the same thing, too. Either we refer them out to someone else and say, we can’t help you, or we say, hey, we can work with you. But to get just like the gentleman that you mentioned, you encourage them to grow their inner professional circle so they can get all the support that they need, because you can’t give them all the answers as opposed to just, yes, someone’s death and saying you can get better because you’re working with a coach, right?

Ashley:

Yep. I know.

Giacomo:

I know.

Ashley:

You and I, we would love to be able to do that, but we just. We can’t do it all.

Giacomo:

Exactly. For sure. Okay, so pivoting a little bit here. You have. You’re a competitive athlete right now. Tell me about your experience with the vegan strong plant build team. What that was like for you. Yeah.

Ashley:

Oh, my goodness. Okay.

Giacomo:

I could talk about so many stories out there, and they’re not out there yet. I want to know. I want to hear yours. I want to hear your experience.

Ashley:

Yeah, well, I could talk about this all day long because I will say so. I’m pretty introverted. And being. Coming up to Atlantic City, I was. I was so excited. But Giacomo, I was also really nervous because, I mean, most of these people I had never met before, I’m watching them on social media, I’m like, oh, my goodness, these athletes are amazing.

Like, so strong, so good at their sports. So, yeah, definitely mixed emotions and very excited and very nervous, which I know can feel like the same thing sometimes times. But once we got to Atlantic City and once we had that first interaction where we were all together, I mean, the hype, the enthusiasm was so contagious. I’m, like, going to start tearing up thinking about it because it’s so cool to be a part, walk into a group and not feel like you have to explain yourself to anybody.

You just all. I mean, I know we’re all very different, but we all just felt the same as well. And so that was. Was just such a cool moment, I think, because for most of us, we train with people who aren’t plant based or aren’t vegan. And so there isn’t that understanding there, that deep understanding of why we’re doing what we’re doing.

And so that was just a really, really special moment for me to kind of just walk in and be like, oh, my gosh, I don’t have to tell anybody that I’m vegan, which is so crazy. So, yeah, actually, one of.

Giacomo:

Sorry, go ahead.

Ashley:

Well, no, one of the crossfit athletes. Oh, my goodness. I’m totally blanking on his name. Not Eddie, not Ryan. Cody. Yeah. Yeah, Cody. He was like, yeah, Cody. He was like, I don’t really know. You tell me a little about yourself. And the first thing I was like, I have to explain that I’m vegan, but I don’t have to explain that. So anyways, that was really cool.

Giacomo:

How about the competition? What was their. How did they react?

Ashley:

Gosh, you know, the competition, everyone was so nice and open. I mean, and they clearly knew who the vegan strong plantbuilt team was, which was really cool. They’re like, yes. You know, I wasn’t there last year, but Sally was. Sally was my crossfit partner. So we met 24 hours before our competition, and we crushed that competition together.

I mean, we. It was amazing. I remember. So we practiced on Friday. We’re like, let’s just practice some box jump overs, because we knew that was going to be in one of our workouts. So we start doing these box and bumpers, and we are so in sync. We were both like, this is weird. Like, no one is that in sync when we literally had just met each other, like, a couple hours ago.

And then we go into the competition, and it was amazing. But everyone in the crossFit, on the CrossFit team who was competing, even the people who were running the competition itself, they were so fond of the vegan strong, plant built team. You could just tell. They’re like, yeah, we remember you guys from last year. It’s so cool to have you back. You know, they’re cheering us on. Like, it was just such a welcoming group. And even our competitors were so nice.

You know, we kind of would chat them up, you know, in between the. Our sets. And even afterwards, when Sally and I ended up winning the CrossFit competition, the people who got second, they were so nice, you know, congratulated us. We congratulated them. It was just a really warm welcome. And you could just tell that the vegan strong plant built team had made an impression last year, which was really cool.

Giacomo:

Nice. See this? I wasn’t privy to a lot of this because I’m very much so in the middle of many things, not figuring that all out, and there’s just so much happening at once, but it’s nice to hear. Did you have any hecklers at all or any. Anything like that? Or any nothing, huh?

Ashley:

No, none. Which, yeah, I figured at least one person would be like, what? You know, vegan strong. You know where to get your protein. But we didn’t even have anyone ask us those questions, and it was all genuine conversations of, like, we’re so glad you’re here. You all are such great athletes. Like, yeah, it was amazing. Dracomo. I mean, everyone was so nice.

Giacomo:

That’s cool. And I’ve been holding the thought for quite some time. Now, during this podcast, I have to hear, I want the audience to know how you and Sally did. How did you fare out there?

Ashley:

So how they set up this event was we had three core workouts that we knew we had to do, and we knew we knew those workouts in advance, so we were able to do a little bit of practice the day before, and we ended up getting second in the first event, first in the second event, and then second in the third event. And so we went into the final, so we qualified to go into the final event, which was really exciting.

We went into that in second place, and we knew that at least we thought we were in second place. There was some confusion, but Sally and I both agreed, yeah, we’re in seconds. So we go into the final event, the points are doubled. And we knew we had to just, we had to really work hard in order to get first place and win the entire thing. Well, back squat.

So we didn’t know what this workout was, so they end up announcing it. Back squats are programmed, which Sally’s a former powerlifter, so she was like, yes, you know, back squats are amazing. Handstand walking was part of it. And I’m like, yes, I love handstand walking. So that was great. And then there were a couple other movements in there. And so Sally and, I mean, we just went, went ham on that for, on that final workout, and we ended up winning, which put us in first place.

And that was just such an amazing feeling. I remember finishing my last thruster, throwing it behind my back, and then just going in and hugging Sally. I mean, it was just such a special moment, and she’s such an amazing person. I’m so thankful that we were able to partner together. I mean, it was like a match made in vegan heaven. So, yeah, it was awesome.

Giacomo:

Is an exceptional athlete. She’s one of those athletes that, like Sophie and many other athletes, where no matter what she does, not only will she give it her all, she’s going to find a way to come out on top. The first competition she did with us our second year, I think she did figure. And then she did powerlifting.

Ashley:

Yep.

Giacomo:

And then she did crossfit several times over with us. So she’s competing with the vegan strong planet team for many, many times over with the vegan with over the course of the past decade. And then the two of you paired up together were obviously a winning combination. All that I knew, I was just looking for the results.

So I did not realize that you went in there, not necessarily at the front of the pack in the lead, and then you stepped it up and then you managed to take the title. I had no idea. That is wild. Congratulations to the both of you.

Ashley:

Thank you. Thank you. It was very exciting. I mean, just the. Everyone was cheering. I mean, it just really felt great. So. And it was great to do it with Sally as well.

Giacomo:

Nice. Yeah. I loved watching the two of you compete for the brief moment that I had a chance to watch you both. Okay, so, and other. Any other thoughts to share while you’re here? Maybe some advice or something, a final thought or two that you would want to leave others with that are listening as far as maybe what they are capable of that they don’t necessarily realize, or some changes that they can make. This or that. Like, how would you want to leave off this audience?

Ashley:

Ooh. So I’ll leave it with. I have a saying that’s on my whiteboard over here that you cannot see, but it says, fear is a prison. Fight for your dreams. And I will say one thing that was really incredible. I’ve been a crossfit athlete for a really long time, over ten years now, and I got to be on the vegan strong plant building team this year. And I think oftentimes we can look at our journey and feel like we aren’t as ahead as we want to be, whether it’s with our maybe vegan activism or our

health when it comes to plant based eating or even in our athletic space. But you never know what’s

going to happen in the future. And so one thing that I always remind myself of, and I like to remind my clients of, too, is that don’t let fear hold you back. Fight for your dreams.

Fight for these things that are really exciting to you, that really add value to your life, because that is going to give your life more purpose, more value. It’s just going to make you more enthusiastic to live this incredible life that you were given.

Giacomo:

That’s wonderful. Fear is a prison. Fight for your dreams.

Ashley:

Yes. I don’t know who said that, but I just love that saying so much.

Giacomo:

Thank you. And how can the listeners find you in the future?

Ashley:

So, the best place to find me would be on Instagram at Plant Centerednutrition. I answer all my DM’s and as many comments as possible there. So if you want to reach out and let me know that you came from Giacomo’s podcast, that would be wonderful. And you can also find my website, Plant centerednutrition us, or even my podcast where I interviewed Giacomo, which is plant centered and thriving.

Giacomo:

Thank you so much for sharing your story, for giving some tips and ideas that hopefully others will be able to take home with them and apply to their everyday life. Thank you for the work that you do, and we will most certainly put everything you just mentioned in the show, notes and more, meaning your instagram, your website, and a way for others to find you. Thank you so much, Ashley.

Ashley:

Thank you, Jackmo. Appreciate it.

Speaker 2

All right, everybody, thank you so much for tuning in to another episode of BJdev vegan proteins muscles by Brussels Radio. We hope you enjoyed the episode. If you have any questions you’d like to have answered on the show, be sure to send them to us@coacheganproteins.com. and if you’re looking for any kind of one on one coaching, absolutely custom bespoke coaching, go to veganproteins.com comma.

Fill out a coaching application and you will hear back from us right away. You can also find us on Facebook, Instagram and YouTube. Thanks so much for tuning in. My name is Danny and I’m fuckwell and we will talk to you soon.